1st Overall Pick.. Who?
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 11:04 AM CST
74 comments
Vote on the Poll below to see who the Rams should take, my opinion, we should take Sam Bradford, our defense is fine currently, we only allowed 20-30 points on some of the top offenses in the whole NFL, our offense is really what is slacking in our game plan, we used to be the greatest show on turf, and that is what worked, we need to jump start the offense. That is what we need to do. Also, the defense did not look that bad, and it is mainly because of our safeties and corner backs dealing with injuries, are DT’s are fine, we do not need any more in the immediate future. We held the highest scoring offense in the NFL, the Saints, to 28 points. The most points we ever scored in a game was against the Saints, 23 points. I think we need our offense to get a little bit better. We scored 10 or less points 9 times this season, including scoring 0 twice, we scored more than 20 points once. Yeah some people say defense wins championships, which it will help, but even if you have some of the best defense in the NFL, and a horrible offense, you wont make it anywhere. Also, with the offense on the field longer, it gives the defense more time to rest, which will result in a better performance out of them.
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Bradford is just not going to be able to help this year, sorry. I’m not even sure he’d be the guy if we were one QB away from being good! Just be patient, don’t waste any of our top 4 picks on a QB, [I’m thinking Suh, then OLB, RB, and WR, not in any order], then maybe take a late-round QB flyer.
But we’ve already got a bunch of middling/maybe capable/journeyman QBs, so I’m not even worried about a QB in the draft at all. See what Null and the other kid can do over the summer. I’m not holding my breath on them, but maybe….there are good QBs to be had thhis year.
agreed!
Im hoping for suh, weatherspoon, mccluster, and im hoping muckelroy drops to the fourth round or we trade up to get him……..how awesome would it be for are starting linebackers to be muckelroy on strongside, the animal in the middle, and weatherspoon on weak
i don't know if
Muckelroy should play the SAM. He is more of a WILL than anything. We have the 1st pick in the 4th…why would we have to trade up on the 1st pick on day 3???
I just dont think we need to make our defense stronger, when it isnt that bad, and our offense strugled to get just a touchdown, we need some young explosiveness on the offensive side
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 12:46 PM CST up reply actions
the Defense isn't that bad, really?
Who didn’t pound them at will?
by CoachConnors on Mar 11, 2010 12:53 PM CST up reply actions
did you go to any of the games this season? They did not look that bad in person, and it is mainly because of our safeties and corner backs dealing with injuries, are DT’s are fine, we do not need any more, I no that for sure, we held the highest scoring offense in the NFL, the Saints, to 28 points. The most points we ever scored in a game was against the Saints, 23 points, not so good huh? I think we need our offense to get a little bit better. We scored 10 or less points 9 times this season, including scoring 0 twice, we scored more than 20 points once.
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 1:10 PM CST up reply actions
The defense definitely played better this year than the offense.
That being said, the Rams need the best players they can possibly get on their team, especially at #1. Bradford at this point doesn’t seem to grade up to Suh or McCoy, or by many accounts Berry. We cannot afford to stretch here. Take the best player at #1, and again in the Second round.
by kickasskeever on Mar 11, 2010 1:34 PM CST up reply actions
I did watch most of the games, home and away
The Saints game? That’s what you base your analysis on?
I agree that the Offense could use weapons, in fact I’m pulling for a top TE, but ….no, the defense was not fine. As a team, I don’t think it matters if I was there in person or on TV. In person is better for some things, team defense isn’t one of them IMHO.
And away from the emotional charge of watching home games in person, league rankings and season stats are a big part of objective evaluation of the the D.
29th in total defense, and 31st in points allowed….only the Lions gave up more, and they were the only team the Rams beat.
Only 5 teams gave up more rushing yards per play, which might make someone think the DT’s are not fine.
While the D was 31st in Points allowed, the offense was 32nd in points scored…….so, yeah I guess we can say the offense played better than the D
by CoachConnors on Mar 11, 2010 1:40 PM CST up reply actions
I
Completely agree with stlcardinals1522. If you watched any of the games this year you would have noticed that we were about 1/2 or more of the games going into half time. The offense couldn’t stay on the field. Therefore, our defense was worn out. Yes, we do need to add to our defense. But, until we get players that can keep the defense rested, the defense will never look as good. 7 games we lost by 10 or less. 5 of those games we scored less than 20 points. And the other 2 just over 20. If your team can put up more than 20 points a game than the Rams would have won about 5 games. QB, nof said.
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 11, 2010 5:22 PM CST up reply actions
As I said, I did watch
Its not about if I would’ve watched them. But hey, If you think they don’t need to make the defense stronger because it isn’t that bad, I won’t be able to convince you.
by CoachConnors on Mar 11, 2010 10:41 PM CST up reply actions
Obviously
they do need to improve their defense. What team doesn’t? Offense is more important. Its an offensive league, QBs win championships.
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 11, 2010 11:12 PM CST up reply actions
You completely agreed with him....
His very first sentence was – “I just dont think we need to make our defense stronger, when it isnt that bad.”
C’mon, seriously.
by CoachConnors on Mar 13, 2010 2:29 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah
I did agree because he’s right and you are completely wrong. Come back to St. Louis and find out what everyone wants around town.
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 14, 2010 12:42 AM CST up reply actions
Ha HA HA
No one needs to go back to the Lou for anything, and it doesn’t mattyer what anyone there wants.
Watching tape on a team that’s #31 in points given up is all you need to do to see they’re not fine.
But I knew I wouldn’t teach the blind to see.
by CoachConnors on Mar 15, 2010 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions
When the Rams come back to Cali, then I'll be going to the games
Until then, the price of plane tickets are probably too much to afford every Sunday. I do go to all the local team’s games though. I see at lot of football in person.
by CoachConnors on Mar 11, 2010 1:44 PM CST up reply actions
They wont be going back with the new ownership
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 3:17 PM CST up reply actions
I tend to agree
Offense was horrendous last season, unwatchable nearly. Our D however was mediocre to below average and if anything I fault them most for looking tired rather than lacking talent.
You know how you keep the D from being tired? Keep them off the field!!! There are two ways to keep them off the field, turnovers/defensive stops or keep the offense on the field. The big problem for me was keeping the offense on the field. I think our D will benefit greatly from a healthy contingent but I am not confident our O will benefit unless we have a QB to threaten a defense in the pass (no more of that 14 men in the box BS).
I been thinking about it lately and I am officially in the QB wagon. I remember watching games with Suh where he looked unevenetful, not a fault of his skill but of his position, and I don’t want low impact positions with the #1 pick. Both these DT’s could be the next warren sapp, but we got players on D already. If we grab a DT with #1 I won’t be sad, but if we grab a QB at #1 I will be very happy.
Would you draft Bradford or Clausen if you knew for sure that they were at best the 4-5 best player in this draft?
by kickasskeever on Mar 11, 2010 2:02 PM CST up reply actions
I would
because I think a B+ QB (dunno what grade I’d give them) is more valuable to me than an A+ DT or S. I think team needs should be considered in this draft though, I put more importance in positional value than value alone, so bound to get differences in opinion.
For probably the 10000000th time
I want Suh. I believe we may take Bradford. Anyone else will me disappointing to me.
I agree
For the most part. I believe that it definitely comes down to either Bradford or Suh. I would much rather have Suh though. I really am nervous of the prospect of Sam Bradford behind a line that isn’t far superior than the defensive lines, like he was last year when he was injured. However, if they were to trade down, highly unlikely, then I would be perfectly alright with that.
If
we trade down to about 10, I wouldn’t mind another OT. Highly unlikely, but QBs need good lineman to succeed. Tell me a good QB that doesn’t have a good line? OK, Aaron Rogers, but he also has legs and a supporting cast. If the Rams think next year is the year for a QB. Build up his supporting cast (O-line, TE, WR) before he comes into the league so they will be ready.
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 11, 2010 5:28 PM CST up reply actions
In the past...
I have been on the Clausen band wagon. Now, I say we need to pull the trigger on Bradford. If we draft Suh, I will be vastly disappointed. I hope that we land Bradford, Tate, and McCluster in the first 3 Rounds. We can help our D later.
I'm torn
on the pick between Bradford and Suh. I’ve been on the Suh bandwagon for a while, but with Bradford’s Wonderlic score, gaining some mass, and seeing Missouri play Oklahoma and get stomped even when we were playing well, has me leaning a bit more toward Bradford.
I’m starting to think that if we get him now, sit him a year behind Bulger, then we use next year as his ‘in the mix’ learning year, then by 2012 we should be a competitive club again. I wouldn’t feel bad about 2011 that way, either.
I love me some good defense, but I also like my team to score points and take care of the football so that the defense doesn’t HAVE to be that good.
THIS year's the year. I hope....
yeah i was the same way with Suh bandwagon, but i looked over it, and decided Bradford would be best, I would like Bradford to start rookie year, or at least get a veteran qb to come to St. Louis and teach Bradford, maybe McNabb if there is any way we could get him which I HIGHLY doubt, or maybe Derek Anderson, sign him to a 1 year contract, have Bradford learn under him, and yeah his wonderlic score was pretty good, 36
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 5:46 PM CST up reply actions
yeah i was the same way with Suh bandwagon, but i looked over it, and decided Bradford would be best, I would like Bradford to start rookie year, or at least get a veteran qb to come to St. Louis and teach Bradford, maybe McNabb if there is any way we could get him which I HIGHLY doubt, or maybe Derek Anderson, sign him to a 1 year contract, have Bradford learn under him, and yeah his wonderlic score was pretty good, 36
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 11, 2010 5:46 PM CST reply actions
we all know
Clausen can take a hit,he came in his 1st yr and was sacked left and right
Bradford needs to be protected,you seen what happened when he wasn’t
We don’t have the line in the ST.L to protect anyone
I don’t want clausen but bradford scares the hell out of me,the kid is not even healthy yet
I voted Suh but i don’t think he’ll fill the seats like bradford thats what this is all about $
I heard today on the radio
during the games we had our line pretty much together they only allowed 14 sacks in 9 games. That doesn’t sound like a situation where we have a terrible offensive line that can’t protect the QB. And I expect the Rams to keep adding depth there so an injury on the line won’t hurt us as much as it did last year.
Many QBs get injured at some pont in their career, but that doesn’t mean they are fragile and will get injured again. Look at Drew Brees. His injury was much worse than Bradford’s and he seems to be doing pretty well now. I think we’re overreacting to Bradford’s injury. Let’s see what happens on his pro day and go from there.
Yeah, our defense wasnt that bad, and yeah it all depends on pro day
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 12, 2010 12:23 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah good point, we need someone exiting to fill the seats, and a DT just really wont do it. But maybe with a new QB other than that Bulger, we will get our OL to step up
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 12, 2010 12:23 PM CST up reply actions
If his shoulder checks out
and he can make all the throw necessary at his pro day – then I say Bradford.
If Bradford is the route the brass decides to go, they better have him signed by draft day or very soon after. Rookie QB holdout is the worst scenario. I would also like to see the new QB (even if it is Suh #1 and a QB from another rd) starting by week 6.
Free Brandon Wood!
I voted Suh,
simply because I perceive he is the best player. I will have no problem with the FO taking someone else though…
But, please, on the day after the great Merlin Olsen passed away, don’t say that DT is not a position that has a big influence on a team’s success.
Trent Dilfer knows you can win a Superbowl with a great D and OLine, even when you have an average QB…
We are not saying it was not a big influence, but you know that there were 3 other great DT’s on his team?
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 12, 2010 12:21 PM CST up reply actions
Yes.
Just like a good QB needs good receivers to catch his passes, good OLs to protect him and a good HB to make the D respect the run.
Oh and half the time, the QB just hands off to the HB. That’s a task even AJ Feeley should be up to.
A DT can help the D on EVERY play.
Ok, I do not see the validity of that argument. I am for a DT also, but a QB is out there every play, and when it comes down to it, DT’s don’t score TDs. QBs can. The Rams should draft Suh because he is the best player in this draft, and they need those quality players.
by kickasskeever on Mar 12, 2010 6:06 PM CST up reply actions
Ok, but in the end, who will end up selling tickets? Bradford or Suh, hmm see Suh get maybe a couple of takles or Bradford through 30 passes? I say Bradford and we need to sell ticket
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 12, 2010 9:28 PM CST up reply actions
Selling tickets doesn't mean anything to me
I wonder why that point gets so much support on these discussions
Because it is a vaild consideration when it comes to running a business. If a team doesn’t sell tickets then it needs to move to somewhere it can.
by kickasskeever on Mar 12, 2010 9:56 PM CST up reply actions
Let me rephrase
Selling tickets doesn’t mean anything to me, I don’t wonder why it gets so much support on these discussions. Winning sells more tickets than name dropping draft picks without having a plan to protect them. I disagree that we have the ability to protect our QB. I’ll believe it when I see it. I also disagree that we need Bradford so bad that we need to pass up on a potential perennial pro-bowler. What good is it gonna do for the FO to keep the Rams inST louis if they lose their jobs due to compromised decision making.
You
can say that anyone drafted number 1 overall will be a perennial pro-bowler. That is an awful point.
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 14, 2010 12:44 AM CST up reply actions
It is what I think of Suh
It’s got nothing to do with who goes number 1. I can NOT say that about every number 1 overall. Suhs the best Bullrusher in the last 20 years. He may need a year or so to get used to the NFL but he will be in many pro bowls. Do you really think there is a Suh caliber player every year. We’ve almost never drafted a QB in the first round, not for 46 years anyway, we can wait one more year.
Selling tickets = more money, more money = better players, better players = winning games, that is why selling tickets is important, and the rams organization wants to get the game on tv, so they buy out the rest of the seats = loosing money. it adds up, and if we could just sell tickets because of bradford, which i think we would, it would be great, yeah people might come one game to see suh play, wohoo he got 2 tackles, isnt that awesome?
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 14, 2010 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Well then I have a plan
Make the cheerleaders go out into the stands and perform lap dances during halftime. No, wait. During the game, because at halftime they’ll be shooting porn. Hey we should draft Joe Cox for that. It could co-star Dick Curl, and sell the tapes with popcorn from the concessions. Close the curtains on the luxury suites and you have yet another income source. And don’t even get me started on the big scoreboard graphics.
Suh or Bradford
That’sa dumb question. I don’t think Bradford is going to be any good. He looks way too weak and fragile to me. If Suh was playing against him, he would break him into pieces. Ask anyone who has had to play against him. It is obvious who the better player is.
You
are so smart, why don’t you run the Rams, Scout, and even play for them?
by GreatestShowOnTurf on Mar 14, 2010 12:45 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah totally dude, if you know or watch college football, you know that Bradford (Oklahoma) and Suh (Nebraska) have played eachother atleast 3-4 times in their careers, is Bradford ripped to pieces?
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 14, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Man, I didn't realize
we had so many NFL quality talent scouts on this site. Which NFL team do you work for, illchild?
Winning games is how to sell tickets.
I don’t think that the ’’popular’’ pick is the way to go about it. In that case we should just draft Tebow with the 1st overall pick since he has so much man love and will sell tickets. BPA and hopefully they will help to win games. Its up to the rams org to make that determination, I have faith in them. I want Suh, but wont mind Bradford,hoping he will stay healthy.
Ok, but like i said earlier, selling tickets = more money, more money = better players, better players = winning games, that is why selling tickets is important, and the rams organization wants to get the game on tv, so they buy out the rest of the seats = loosing money. it adds up, and if we could just sell tickets because of bradford, which i think we would, it would be great, yeah people might come one game to see suh play, wohoo he got 2 tackles, isnt that awesome?
by stlcardinals1522 on Mar 14, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
How many tickets will sell if Bradford gets hurt? Bradford + Injury + Big QB contract= loosing money
Wow Bradford played in 2 games before he got hurt, awesome! Anyone can get hurt in this game at anytime, but Bradford’s chance is a lot higher. He brings an increased factor of risk/reward than Suh. Suh has a great chance of improving the players around him. Ok he gets 2 tackles, Long gets 2 sacks, JL makes numerous plays. Bradford will need lots of help from our offense to win games, our defense is not that far off from becoming solid with a few key additions.
well that is a weak point. Anyone can get hurt and then you lose money. Suh has two replaced knees how can you say that isn’t an increased injury risk.
by kickasskeever on Mar 15, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
By that logic, losing leads to not being able to afford star players
And that’s not the case. They don;t get all their money from ticket sales, that’s the very reason all the teams participate in revenue sharing. Otherwise big market teams really would have a huge advantage in ticket sales and player salaries. But that’s just not how it works (anymore)
by CoachConnors on Mar 15, 2010 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Why do you think Bradford is more likely to get hurt?
He had one injury in college. Suh had injuries to his knees in college. Why is it more likely that Bradford will be injured the second time than Suh, when it’s Suh who plays in the position where people are constantly falling onto your legs.
I think this whole “he might get hurt” stuff is silly. Let’s talk about what the guys can do for the team and stop worrying about how one or the other might get hurt.
It would help people if you used the reply button
Only five players have averaged 25 and 10 in their playoff careers. One of them, Dirk Nowitzki.
by Blair Rocket on Mar 14, 2010 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Because Bradford has not played since his Injury.
Suh has played since his knee injuries while Bradford was out with his shoulder. Bradford will be testing his ‘new’ shoulder out in the NFL where players are bigger,faster, and stronger. We have not seen him take any hits since his shoulder surgery. Honestly I hope he is fine and wish him well, but seeing Suh play this year and nothing of Bradford is why I made that comment.
If he never got hurt I doubt there would be much question to who the rams should pick.
my bad, should have read farther, GOOD POINT!
by kickasskeever on Mar 15, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
That shows what a close call it is.
I’ll be happy with either one of thm. In fact, why don’t we change the rules so the team that picks first gets two picks before anyone else in years ending in 10? Seems fair to me.
Yep this pick is going to be very interesting.
Whoever they pick I hope he becomes a player and a future leader. Both guys seem strong in the leadership category. If Bradford checks out at his pro day, which I think he will, the votes may end up in his favor prior to the draft.
I am still wondering if they will wait until the actual draft day to make this pick or sign one of these guys to a contract before the draft. Which move would provide more leverage for the organization? I don’t see a trade happening, but I can hope!
It would be Very smart to get him signed before they announce his name
whoever it is, assuming they can’t make a trade. I remember when the Raiders had Jamarcus all picked out weeks before the draft, called his name and only then found out he wanted more gauranteed money than they were willing to pay….sat out his rookie season, never developed right, just huge mess. Hopefully they will have a good idea about trade possibilities and the different players contract demands before draft day. The Rams guys are a pretty sharp group, no doubt about that.
by CoachConnors on Mar 15, 2010 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I would hope they negotiate with both Bradford and Suh.
That way they know whether either one of them is going to be difficult to sign. If one of them asks for the moon, while the other is reasonable, that could affect who they pick – and that might cause the agents to be a little less greedy. They definitely should try to have him signed before the draft, whoever it is.
Good point. There is a very real chance that Bradford won't want to be a Ram
with that crappy O-line. And Suh would probably want to play for Spags. Which goes back to that injury argument, any QB that plays for the Rams is much more likely to get injured than any DT in the league. And don’t tell me that a great D doesn’t sell seats. I’ve been a Ram fan long enough to appreciate great defenses. Suh will average way more than 2 tackles a game and most of those will be in the backfield. I would much rather watch Suh break through the line and drop a RB for a 3 yard lose and follow that with introducing the opposing QB to the turf, as opposed to watching our QB run for his life. Championship teams are balanced O and D, and games ARE won in the trenches. It’s not all about the QB.
Hmm....I'd bet ANY Qb in the league is more likely to get injured than any DT
I don’t think that’s a Ram’s phenomenon. Maybe it just seems like it but QB’s get hurt regularly. Unless you have data you want to share that shows its a Rams thing?
The O-Line had pretty bad injuries from the get go, don’t forget. Hard to imagine them not being better this year with health and Smith not being a rookie anymore. Bradford might not know anything about that, though. Hopefully he has accepted the fact he’s going to one of last year’s big losers because if it’s not the Rams it’ll one of the other low-W teams.
The blind stares of a million pairs of eyes, lookin hard but won't realize, that they'll never see the C. And when I'm rollin by, you can't see me!
by CoachConnors on Mar 16, 2010 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Good point about who might really want to play for Spags
I wonder if these draftees know enough about Spags to want to come play for him. I would hope so, but you never know. If you’re a DT, who do you hope to play for? The Bucs don’t have Monte Kiffin anymore.
For QB’s, I think Clausen was just doing some PR work when he said he like Carroll, but then again…who knows. That might look like a better situation than the Rams.
The blind stares of a million pairs of eyes, lookin hard but won't realize, that they'll never see the C. And when I'm rollin by, you can't see me!
by CoachConnors on Mar 16, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions
This is almost a philosophical question.
Obviously fans would rather watch a winning team than a losing one. No problem. However, which type of winning team would fans rather watch? Would they rather watch a team that wins 38-31 or one that wins 12-9? While some fans who appreciate a tough team would go for the low scoring wins, I think the majority of fans would choose the high scoring option since they get to get excited about more TDs for the home team. When the Greatest Show was winning high scoring games, the fans were dancing in the aisles with every Rams TD, and when they gave up a TD the fans just expected the Rams to come right down the field and score again. You don’t have that same expectation for a low-scoring, defense oriented team.
There isn’t any right answer here, and clearly either option is far better than what we have right now, but it is an interesting question to me. Given the choice, which type of winning team would excite the fan base more? I think it’s the high scoring one.
No doubt we want to see TD's especially through the air.
The Greatest Show on Turf was without a doubt the most exciting offense in all of football, and I’d love to see some of that again soon. That is what was missing in the old days of our great defenses. It’s just really hard to be a championship team without a D. I just hope Devaney and Spags build a well balanced team and not neglect any aspect of the game. At least we defended against kick returns much better last year. That says a lot about the coaching to me. How about we beat the mediocre teams 30-13 and the good teams 24-17.
Coach, no data, just seems like the Ram QB’s are always running for their lives, but Bulger has gotten gun shy too. Little wonder. I do expect the O-line to be much improved this year though. As you pointed out, Smith won’t be a rookie and hopefully we won’t have so many injuries. I also expect we pick up an O-lineman with one of our first 4 picks. Build from the inside out.
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