Quarterback decisions, future and present, for the Rams
by VanRam on Dec 14, 2009 10:39 AM CST
in 2009 regular season
41 comments
Here's the least insightful statement you'll read today: The St. Louis Rams need a starting QB for the 2010 season. Discussion around that subject has begun in earnest in the wake of rookie Keith Null's debut against the Titans yesterday. GM Billy Devaney has several routes for finding the team's next signal caller with a very high pick in the draft or more financial flexibility thanks to lots of junk contracts going off the books after this season.
First, let's talk about the rest of the season. Devaney's reluctance to put Marc Bulger on IR and reports this weekend that he will miss at least two more games make me wonder if they aren't hoping that Bulger might be able to start the season's final game, a showdown with the 49ers at the Dome. Bulger's status with the Rams and in general is up in the air after this season. There are reports that Bulger might just retire after this season. Retire or not, it seems likely that the Rams would part ways with Bulger, since he clearly doesn't have much left in his abused body and may be unwilling to renegotiate his contract. So for the next two games it comes down to a choice between Keith Null and Kyle Boller, a push in my opinion.
There are some bona fide first round talents at the quarterback position this year, and the Rams will certainly go through their due diligence on those players. They have to. Of course, if history is any indication, the Rams might not be taking a QB in the first round, especially with what will most likely be the first or second overall pick. The last time a franchise that included Billy Devaney as a member of the front office staff drafted a QB was the San Diego Chargers in 1998 who drafted Ryan Leaf.
That leaves the free agent (or trade) market which is really, really tough to predict at this point given the labor dispute. Some of the names being mentioned include, surprisingly and unsurprisingly, two current members of the Eagles. From Peter King:
Interesting tidbit from respected St. Louis Post-Dispatch columnist Bernie Miklasz: "I would not be surprised, at all, to see the Rams make a play for Philadelphia Eagles quarterback Michael Vick after the season.'' I agree.
Miklasz has a penchant for dramatics and overstating whispers. However, Vick might just be a decent fit for an offense that seems steadfastly determined to not throw a ball more than 7 yards down the field, no matter how much they might need to. And then there's this slightly more surprising tidbit:
Also would not be surprised to see the Rams make a very quiet inquiry about Donovan McNabb after the season either. Not saying the Eagles would make such a deal (two second-rounders and a four for McNabb?), but Kevin Kolb will be a fourth-year player, and Philly's not going to be able to keep him until McNabb retires.
Obviously, that's a little more of a stretch, but given the connections between this coaching staff and the Eagles, it's not surprising, since proximity does a lot to start rumors in the NFL. McNabb turns 34 next season, so it would be a short-term solution, like say if you were drafting a QB. I don't know that the Rams can really afford to be surrendering second round picks for 34-year-olds. Strangely enough Kevin Kolb has been mentioned as a possibility too.
Then, there's always Jason Campbell who has a 65 percent completion rate and has been playing at a high level this season despite the team around him.
Whoever the Rams start at quarterback next season, let's hope they get some receiving talent for that person to throw to, but that's another discussion for another time.
Finally, let's go back to the season at hand. Personally, I'd probably just start Null. The difference between him or Boller under center is neglible and doesn't increase the chances of the team winning either way. If Bulger is cleared to play in week 17, do you start him? Only three more games to think about the current crop of Rams quarterbacks, and that's good news in and of itself.
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This is a tough one.
Both of them are not good based on what we saw. But the difference is that Boller consistently proved he is bad where as Null has only one game. Based on the I would say start Null. But I agree that neither of them is the answer.
Football players, like prostitutes, are in the business of ruining their bodies for the pleasure of strangers. ~Merle Kessler
by mlkgandhiv2k on Dec 14, 2009 10:46 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Vick=more bootlegs=more open recievers I think.
But is he more or less accurate than Boller?
Football players, like prostitutes, are in the business of ruining their bodies for the pleasure of strangers. ~Merle Kessler
by mlkgandhiv2k on Dec 14, 2009 10:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably about the same (accuracy-wise) as Boller.
But that’s not very good.
I just don’t see how Vick makes the “team” better. To me, acquiring Vick is an Oakland Raiders type move. Sure, we might win a couple more games but we aren’t really getting any better down the road.
Oakland makes moves each year based on getting better right now. The problem is they stink so they’ll be stuck in that 4 win territory every single year. That’s not where I want to see the Rams, spinning their wheels acquiring Mike Vick or Randy Moss or whomever just to win a couple more wins next year. It’s pointless and personally I believe Devaney and Spags have a much larger vision for the franchise.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
by Tackle Box on Dec 14, 2009 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's because
we need to draft Sam Bradford 1st no matter where we end up it the Draft order.
by ZamRam on Dec 15, 2009 5:14 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd rather Null play...
…because it gives us the best chance at Suh with the 5 picks and whatnot.
Ideally, Bulger takes a paycut and gets a WR worth a damn. As a matter of fact, I’d actually venture to say that #1 receiver is our biggest offensive need. Our offense isn’t bad because of the QB. It’s bad because we don’t have a legit, at least starter-caliber Tight End, our best WR would be a #3 or 4 on most other teams, and our backup runningbacks don’t belong in the NFL, which immediately telegraphs to the other team that “hey, Steven isn’t in there, it’s a pass, despite those godawful receivers.”
Not to say Marc is excused, but like the coaches in general, this is garbage to work with besides S-Jax and 3-4 solid lineman. As a matter of fact, he started showing flashes before he went down.
Since we’re going to bring a rookie in during the next two drafts (my hope is that it’s not till NEXT draft), then he might as well have some weapons to work with. We can take a solid WR in the second round after taking Suh in the first. Some names include Damian Williams (solid route runner, excellent hands), and Golden Tate (great deep threat, good hands, think Panthers’ Steve Smith).
A tight end would be nice too. There’s so many more problems on offense. Starting with the QB, which isn’t quite the worst unit of the bunch, isn’t the way to go IMO. Not if Marc were to take a paycut somehow, however unlikely. I’m not sold on him leaving quite yet. Spags seems endeared to him.
"I was just letting the shots fly. You know, I don't leave any bullets in the chamber."
"Everything negative- pressure, challenges- is all an opportunity for me to rise."
-Kobe Bryant
A mantra for all athletes.
by TrojanRam on Dec 14, 2009 11:30 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
"it gives us the best chance at Suh with the 5 picks and whatnot."
Not only do I disagree with this statement, but I’m having trouble understanding the last six words.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
by Tackle Box on Dec 14, 2009 12:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Umm...really?
I actually think Boller, just for the fact that the coaching staff doesn’t trust him to throw deep (or trusts him NOT to throw deep), gives us our best chance to win because he won’t make AS many mistakes as Null. I mean, everyone’s going crazy over the 1 TD he threw, but it was set up by a fake punt of all things. We didn’t get past the 40 on offense until garbage time down by 40.
The 5 picks is the INTs, sorry, it isn’t clear enough considering I’m talking about the draft. What I mean is, Null will likely throw 2-3 picks or more again. I hear talks of sitting S-Jax to prevent further damage to him this season. It almost seems like a good idea, but unlikely given his warrior mentality.
Go RAMS!
"I was just letting the shots fly. You know, I don't leave any bullets in the chamber."
"Everything negative- pressure, challenges- is all an opportunity for me to rise."
-Kobe Bryant
A mantra for all athletes.
by TrojanRam on Dec 14, 2009 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Boller won't (or isn't allowed to) throw the ball over 10 yards.
That helps nothing.
If Bulger had been healthy we beat the Bears.
And regarding the “5 picks”, yeah I though you were talking about draft picks. My mistake.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
by Tackle Box on Dec 14, 2009 4:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No, I was just saying Null can help us get Suh...
…by throwing 5 picks every game. Look, by all means, I want us to win these last 3 games. I’d love nothing more than Null beating the Niners/Cards. That’s as sweet as it gets besides playoffs/Superbowl (oh that feeling is so distant).
At the same time however, I feel our defense (and team) can be significantly better with Suh and a good free agency (as well as the rest of the draft). I think Boller had a better chance of winning because we didn’t turn the ball over as much with him than we did with Null. Our defense has shown it can be good enough to keep us in games, but turnovers are backbreakers and it showed yesterday.
I don’t wish any harm on the Rams’ or Null, I want us to win these last 3 games, but I wonder what would really help us more in the future since this year is pretty much dead.
And you’re right, Bulger would have beat the Bears almost with ease. Go Rams!
"I was just letting the shots fly. You know, I don't leave any bullets in the chamber."
"Everything negative- pressure, challenges- is all an opportunity for me to rise."
-Kobe Bryant
A mantra for all athletes.
by TrojanRam on Dec 14, 2009 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just understand that the Bears are putrid.
Boller’s “succes” (or whatever you’d call it) against the Bears would not have translated to anything close against the Titans.
Boller was given primo field position all day in Chicago and couldn’t do anything with it. Even with the great field position, turnovers generated from the defense, and Jackson running for over 100 yards, all Boller’s offense could muster was 3 field goals.
If you really want the best guarantee Suh, you’d probably be better off with Boller behind center.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
by Tackle Box on Dec 14, 2009 10:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's tough--
It’s tough to get a lot of other fans to see the Bears game that way. But I agree. Its to bad guys coming up to the draft don’t have to “qualify” and play for a year in the NFL before being drafted. That would stop a lot of Busts and reveal hidden talent in lots of guys. Just thinkin’
by Knoxfan on Dec 15, 2009 6:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd like Null
I mean, as of now, the rest of the season is pretty much seeing what goes right and what goes wrong…and I can’t imagine using Boller very much next year. Maybe Bulger with a huge paycut, and definitely we’ll see some Null next year. So IMO Null should just get used to playing in the NFL for the rest of the season.
Sigh…I didn’t think that the season would be bad enough that we could look for someone as low as Vick…
by hr on Dec 14, 2009 11:55 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Touche on Vick...
…ugh.
"I was just letting the shots fly. You know, I don't leave any bullets in the chamber."
"Everything negative- pressure, challenges- is all an opportunity for me to rise."
-Kobe Bryant
A mantra for all athletes.
by TrojanRam on Dec 14, 2009 11:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
BULGER
The name's Rams, St. Louis Rams.
by Bond_007x on Dec 14, 2009 12:02 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Here's a question...
If the Eagles aren’t able to hang on to Kolb, would we be interested in him??
Would you rather have Kolb or Vick?
I’m not stating my case for either, just presenting a question to the TST board.
by bdemartin on Dec 14, 2009 12:46 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If Kolb is available than I think he would be a better choice.
Because he is probably more accurate and any one in the league is more mobile than bulger so rollouts can still be used.
Football players, like prostitutes, are in the business of ruining their bodies for the pleasure of strangers. ~Merle Kessler
by mlkgandhiv2k on Dec 14, 2009 10:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't the guy to target on the Eagles....
be Kolb? Young, accurate, talented.
What would it take to pry him away? Would the cost be similar to Matt Schaub (2 second round picks)? Do the Rams have enough talent to deal two second round picks? It should at least be something the team looks at.
Dave "Howland" Randell
Co-Creator of RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Howland on Dec 14, 2009 1:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Answers
Wouldn’t the guy to target on the Eagles be Kolb
Yes, if he’s available, but if not any of their QBs would be fine, depending if we want a short term solution to bridge the gap for QB of the Future, or if we want a QB of the future, Kolb would be the guy.
What would it take to pry him away?
I don’t know, maybe a couple mid- rounders, 3-5 rounds.
Do the Rams have enough talent to deal two second round picks?
No. We need all the picks we can get.
I’d like Kolb, but I’d be fine with Vick, bridge-gapper, and might bring some excitement to the Rams. Also allows us to draft Suh and 2nd/3rd rounder we deem worthy to be our future QB.
Can't think of a good sig
by Carneros on Dec 14, 2009 8:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Fuck Vick, he can go die
I’m finding a new team to cheer for if we sign his
by hisTALLness on Dec 14, 2009 1:14 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
constructive!
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 14, 2009 3:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My vote
is for Kolb or Jason Campbell. Then take the best player available every time it is our turn to pick in the draft. Starting with Suh, use every pick on the best player. If Kolb can be the next Matt Schuab when given a chance to play, I like what that does for the Rams for the next 5-6 years at least (hopefully).
Another thought that I had that is much more unrealistic is trading for Anquan Boldin. What do you all think? What kind of package would it take to get him? Would the Cards trade him within the division? Assuming they would, would he then be worth said package to a rebuilding rams team in need of a #1 WR?
by stlunc1 on Dec 14, 2009 1:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If we get Boldin somehow...
…I think Bulger’s career here would revitalize. As well as our offense. We’d have the two toughest offensive players at two positions: Boldin at WR, S-Jax at RB. I’d love our physicality, and you best believe Marc can hit Boldin. I mean, if he made Donnie Avery look good at times, he can make Boldin look better. I’ve pondered this for a while. Maybe a 3rd rounder. Especially if they think his injuries don’t warrant a high paycheck. I’d love for us to make a play for him, especially if they don’t believe we’re a threat to them in the div for a while.
Boldin, Avery, Robinson, Gibson, Amendola, Burton. I’d like our receiving corps so much more if they all moved down a spot on the depth chart.
"I was just letting the shots fly. You know, I don't leave any bullets in the chamber."
"Everything negative- pressure, challenges- is all an opportunity for me to rise."
-Kobe Bryant
A mantra for all athletes.
by TrojanRam on Dec 14, 2009 1:26 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
well put
especially the last part having are receivers slide down a spot would be a great start. Boldin would be a good pick up as well.
by keeperskillz24 on Dec 14, 2009 3:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Qb's
I think the Rams should make a serious bid for Kevin Kolb, he is young, accurate, and is definetly ready to be a starting QB for someone, so why not the Rams. Micheal Vick has never been much of a passing QB, he has a strong arm but his accuracy is horrid. Im not sold on Jason Cambell either,he has looked better this year, but he is isnt worth the gamble, if the Rams plan on gambling, gamble in the draft( which I dont think much of the QS’s in the draft) which I dont think they will.
We will probably end up with the number one pick in April, I would like to see the Rams draft Mark Ingram, but would be happy with Suh as well. We need another viable running back to spell Stephen Jackson or to step in if he gets injured. This is the first season Stephen didnt miss time to injury, and Darby, Gaddo isnt the answer. If it wasnt for the Rams niether would be in football. Second round they could go after a Dez Bryant or Golden Tate(if they make it to the second round) we need a Deshaun Jackson type guy, who can return kicks and punts as well as get down field as a reciever.
The Rams still have alot of holes to fill, but I like the job Spaggs is doing, we have made alot of strides, but we need a QB, DT, and down field threats to take pressure of Stephen, who was a beast this year, despite all the 8 and 9 man fronts. Go Rams.
by wildbunch on Dec 14, 2009 2:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Good thought
It wasn’t the Rams offense that let the Titans score 47 points. I have been trying to make the point all year that its the Defense that is in desperate need. Forget the QB, RB, WR’s, DE’s ! Draft for the BIG D!
by Knoxfan on Dec 14, 2009 2:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd gladly welcome Vick into town
But that doesn’t mean we can’t draft a QB
by njd.aitken on Dec 14, 2009 2:35 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
im on the kolb train....
i would like to wait a year to try and draft mallet….draft suh, tate and muckelroy in the first 3 rounds
by Danteslion on Dec 14, 2009 2:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Knox
When you go three and out, or throw five picks, or cant move the ball to let the defense rest alittle bit, opposing offenses will put big numbers up. Granted Chris Johnson had a big part of that, but he has been doing that to good defenses for 2 years.
The offense has to move the ball take some time off the clock, score and let the defense rest. The defense needs help, but we have no O besides Jackson, thats the bigger priority. You cant win if you cant score.
by wildbunch on Dec 14, 2009 2:57 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Good thought again--But
Our team’s Defense will almost always change the opponent’s game plan. Their big numbers come from the fact that they KNOW they will be successful by going deep on us. Games aren’t won by pounding one super running back over and over. We really know that. Less the Greatest Show on Turf, Defenses determine the tempo of the game IMO. I think I would take a powerful D over a powerful O , just my opinion.
by Knoxfan on Dec 14, 2009 3:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i see both sides
because pretty much all areas need improvement i think we all can agree. But theirs times to fix problems and wait. Suh is one of the best players coming out of the draft if not the best. We are in position to fix a spot with a high caliber player. Drafting a quarterback would not make sense to me in the first round I could live with it in the 2nd for the right guy but no one impresses me i think we should do what it takes to get kolb for a big signing. even if that means using a second round pick. Then the third possibly a trade for a big receiver if we cant get boldin or anyone else thats worth it draft a DE i want this D line to improve i think its are biggest priority besides who’s going to be are quarterback.
by keeperskillz24 on Dec 14, 2009 3:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Dont get me wrong
I would give anything to have a smashmouth defense, and a productive offense, we have so many needs I get greedy. I get lost in past glory of “The Geatest Show on Turf”, Warner, Faulk, Holt, Az-Hakiim, Bruce, they spoiled me, now it just kills me to see the offense so stagnate. I guess no matter how we go this offseason its better than what we got.
by wildbunch on Dec 14, 2009 3:25 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
No doubt...
I remember when 3rd and 25 was no big deal, Warner would drop back and pick up 30 yards to one of the fore mentioned players. Looked foward to Sundays back then, now its just another day of the week.
by wildbunch on Dec 14, 2009 3:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Kolb, Cambell, Vick OR a franchise QB in the 1st/2nd round of the draft?
I think a lot depends on where we actually end up picking in the draft. Could we lose all the remaining games this year? Absolutely, just look at our list of IRs…and it’s growing. If somehow, someway Tampa Bay wins a game and we lose our last 3 games we could get DT Ndamukong Suh in the 1st round and pick up a ‘franchise’ QB in the 2nd round without a problem plus not have to pay 1st round bucks for a quarterback.
Here’s a look at the 1st and 2nd round QB’s that have been drafted since 2005:
2009
Round 1
1 Mathew Stafford Detroit Lions
5 Mark Sanchez New York Jets
17 Josh Freeman Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Round 2
44 Pat White Miami Dolphins
2008
Round 1
3 Matt Ryan Atlanta Falcons
18 Joe Flacco Baltimore Ravens
Round 2
57 Chad Henne Miami Dolphins
2007
Round 1
1 JaMarcus Russell Oakland Raiders
22 Brady Quinn Cleveland Browns
Round 2
36 Kevin Kolb Philadelphia Eagles
40 John Beck Miami Dolphins
43 Drew Stanton QB Detroit Lions
2006
Round 1
3 Vince Young Tennessee Titans
10 Matt Leinart Arizona Cardinals
11 Jay Cutler Denver Broncos
Round 2
49 Kellen Clemens New York Jets
64 Tarvaris Jackson Minnesota Vikings
2005
Round 1
1 Alex Smith San Francisco 49ers
24 Aaron Rodgers Green Bay Packers
25 Jason Campbell Washington Redskins
Round 2
None Selected
I say go for it!
Go Rams!
"We can't run. We can't pass. We can't stop the run. We can't stop the pass. We can't kick. Other than that, we're just not a very good football team right now." --- Bruce Coslett, New York Jets Head Coach circa 1990s
by Nbr1RamFan on Dec 14, 2009 5:06 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
draft
if the rams end up not getting SUH because he is off the board wouldnt it make sense to trade down and get extra picks?
by dbacks4life on Dec 14, 2009 5:26 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Jake Locker
if we do go QB he wont be an option, he is going back to school…..ESPN reports
I Want The Rams Back In LA....The More They Lose The More Of A Chance That It Will Happen....Sorry St Louis You Cant Keep A Team(Twice)...Rams Come Home....We'll Be Here For You When You Do
by JordansDad on Dec 14, 2009 8:39 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
i hope rams draft sam bradford #1 pick
NO TO VICK AND NO TO MCNABB NEVER WILL HAPPEN
by Thomas W on Dec 14, 2009 9:52 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
It Suh is gone why not select "Best Available Player" in round 1
and then take a QB in round two? I mean, just how many teams will be looking to draft a QB in the 1st round. So many teams have already been there, done that over the past 6-7 years. Seems to me there ought to be a good one that lasts into round 2.
Go Rams!
"We can't run. We can't pass. We can't stop the run. We can't stop the pass. We can't kick. Other than that, we're just not a very good football team right now." --- Bruce Coslett, New York Jets Head Coach circa 1990s
by Nbr1RamFan on Dec 15, 2009 1:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
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